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========================================================================= (C) 1994 by Atari Corporation, GEnie, and the Atari Roundtables. May be reprinted only with this notice intact. The Atari Roundtables on GEnie are *official* information services of Atari Corporation. To sign up for GEnie service, call (with modem) 800-638-8369. Upon connection type HHH (RETURN after that). Wait for the U#= prompt.Type XTX99437,GENIE and press [RETURN]. The system will prompt you for your information. ========================================================================== Category 14, Topic 20 Message 1 Mon Jan 17, 1994 B.SEMAAN [BOSEM] at 19:32 EST The NEC-P driver does not work with the LQ-800. For now we owners of Epson LQ (pre 570) printers are stuck with the Star NB24-15 driver. If Atari ever gets around to sending me the GDOS developer's kit I am going to write an LQ driver for Speedo. I also need a relational database in Atari Works. To me a 'flat' database is like drinking decaf coffee. I don't care about mailing lists or any other lists for that matter, and to be frank about it I have never been able to find any use in a non-relational database. The idea that a relational DB has to be difficult to use is a total falsehood. I see no reason why the simple tasks available in AW now would have to become intimidating just to add relational capability for those users who need it. Besides, many users will find they've outgrown AW's database as soon as they try to manipulate their data, rather than simply organize it. Bob ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 2 Mon Jan 17, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 21:30 EST Papa, Thanks for the info on database. (Poop on the dog biscuits?) Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 3 Mon Jan 17, 1994 C.KROWCHUK1 [CHRIS] at 22:01 EST Papa, I have reported BPS several times where it has occured on a 9 pin dot matrix. V2.107 w/ speedo4.1 and roland 1011, a 9 pin "low quality" workhorse. I know its old but it is faithful and real loud tooo! (I am getting the impression that maybe someone should be taking a list if Pradip isn't?) Chris. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 4 Mon Jan 17, 1994 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 22:20 EST Couldn't Atari or someone offer these people with 1.207 a 1.2 version until they get it fixed (which may be a LONG time considering they have Pradip doing something else)? Since they already OWN AW, going to a earlier version SHOULDN'T be a problem. Of course, knowing how Atari works, they would probably charge for a downgrade. They always did do things backwards. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 5 Tue Jan 18, 1994 COMPO at 00:07 EST The current release of SpeedoGDOS is 4.2. Robert ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 6 Tue Jan 18, 1994 E.SLICK [Eric] at 01:58 EST Charlie, Thanks for the tip on Aladdin. I'll check it out pronto. Papa, The soft page doesn't work--already tried it. However, if you are doing multiple copies or a mail merge, BPS happens only on the first page printed out. Also, if you create a dummy page and the print pages 2-??, BPS is still on the first page printed. So far the only work around is to get 1.2 are grit your teeth and waste a bunch of toner or ribbons. IMHO Atari should have jumped on this problem right away and offered and immediate solution (even if that meant making 1.2 available free to 1.207 owners). Not even one call back for my three calls... I'm not a happy camper and my initial enthusiasm is now marked by disappointment--mainly due to the lack of (seemingly so) effort on Atari's part to fix this deadly problem. AW 1.207 is essentially useless due to BPS and it seems that those of us who bought it have been left to fend for ourselves. This situation has not encouraged me to think that Atari stands behind their products. It's very frustrating. If you have not already, send your BPS information to Pradip via Email. List all the essential info. I guess it's time to make another call... Eric (Disappointed but still hopeful) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 7 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:45 EST Al, From the little bit of time I've had with Storm so far it looks quite capable. I haven't tried doing a split screen or two windows with it yet to see if I can have an RT or EMail message on screen while I am composing a reply. That would really be a tremendous help. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 8 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:46 EST Rob, The answer of course is to get a bigger hard drive which I sorely need to do but other concerns carry a higher priority right now. I do my books on floppies so I don't have to concern myself about where the IMG's might be and then make archival backups to a folder on the hard disk. The time it takes to do an incremental save gives me a moment to think about what I am going to say next or pour another cup of coffee. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 9 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:46 EST BOSEM, I partially agree with you on the relational database point. They _do_not_ necessarily need to be difficult to use or learn to use. Many times a relational database is really the only viable way to perform a specific group of tasks. I have yet to see any database, relational or not, that is as intuitive as the AtariWorks database. I think having Form fields that could be expanded vertically for multiline entries and some simple record linking capabilities would greatly add to the database's utility without adding too much to the size of the code or runtime overhead. As far as the intimidation factor goes - there are a great many users out there who are intimidated by any kind of database. Strangely enough they often have no problems using something like Cardfile. I think what intimidates them is the necessity of creating and assigning attributes to the fields. The very sense of intimidation and the fear of losing some important data are enough to create a mental block where databases are concerned. AtariWorks may well serve as their first introduction to creating and using databases. As their experience grows and their concept of how they want to manipulate their data becomes clear they will naturally gravitate toward programs such as Superbase to achieve their aims. I would hazard a guess that the majority of users will find their database needs fully met by a flat file database and would not use any relational capabilities even if they were present. All they want to do is organize their data as simply as possible and be able to retrieve what they want when they want it with little or _preferably_ no fuss. Please don't take this a "putdown" - as we all know, gentlemen _do_ disagree. What I have to say is nothing more than my opinion from my peculiar perspective and, while I have never been known to be wrong, I am sometimes misled, misinformed, missing memory cells or just plain myopic. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 10 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:46 EST Ken Van, You're welcome. 'Papa' who is trying to keep the spaces intact. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 11 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:47 EST Chris, Somehow that slipped by me. Mike Allen did some rather extensive testing of various drivers via print to disk to see what code was actually being generated. Brian Harvey posted the results to Pradip. With your experience it appears that BPS strikes everywhere and no one using 1.207 is immune. There haven't been any posts yet from anyone trying my "soft page break" suggestion. I have no way to check it out myself but I hope it provides a usable workaround until the problem can be solved. It's definitely a funky way to do things but "one does what one can with what one has". 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 12 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:47 EST Wayne, We don't actually OWN the software we have purchased. We don't always even OWN the media on which it was distributed. What we do possess is a LICENSE to use it subject to various restrictions. From a legal point of view I cannot condone a user providing a copy of 1.2 to someone who has purchased 1.207. I do, neverthless, believe that doing so does not violate the SPIRIT of the copyright laws - just the letter of the law. As far as Atari making downgrades to 1.2 available upon return of 1.207 disks - that makes sense from a user's point of view. The problem with doing something like that is that it is tantamount to saying they can't fix the problem. This is just the kind of opening the competition is looking for to discredit Atari in the Jaguar arena. It makes more sense from a corporate standpoint to simply acknowledge the problem's existence and state that it will be corrected as soon as possible without specifying a date. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 13 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:47 EST To All, If anyone feels that my posts are just simply getting too long or that I am using the RT as a forum for opinions that are better expressed elsewhere please let me know. I promise not to be offended. Sometimes I get to thinking I need someone to rein me in. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 14 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 03:09 EST Eric, Thanks for trying the "soft page break" idea. Maybe it can still work if AW is given something to print before it. If not all I can say is, "AAAARGHH!!!" I agree that AtariWorks is next to useless if you can't get decent printouts from it. I don't have a problem with BPS myself since I am using 1.2 but I am just as frustrated as you are. I have a vested interest in seeing AtariWorks succeed. If it doesn't I won't have anyone to sell my books to and many hundreds of hours work will have to be chalked up to experience. I see from my previous posts that the spaces are not coming through. I am using Oracle 1.2 at home and have Oracle 1.3 at the office. Possibly that is what is doing the nasty to me. I think I better get cracking on Storm. 'Papa' online and hitting CR before the prompts. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 15 Tue Jan 18, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:21 EST Eric, LoadAlad will force Aladdin to use any of the TT's other ports. There's a demo of it in the files here. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 16 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 05:10 EST In AW, if, say, I write a big paragraph in just the upper left quadrant of the 8.5X11 page (visualize the page divided into quarters). Now, I want to go back and type in something in the UPPER RIGHT quadrant (I'm kinda making the upper part of the page into a TWO column piece), how do I do it? If I type in that upper right quadrant, when I try to JUST select the upper left part to, say, change its font size, AW thinks the whole upper part is ONE paragraph. I don't want that; I want two SEPARATE parts, one on the left and one on the right. In pagestream all I'd have to do is draw a Column on that right side, or put a "box" around the right side, and I could work on just THAT side. Hope I explained it correctly. in AW, if I try to 'darken' the upper left side only, to change that font, the dark area goes all the way across the screen. Don't want that ,need two separate parts, independant of each other. Mike a ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 17 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 15:44 EST Mike, You need to set up a page that is one column wide. Type your text and do all editing on that page then copy the text blocks over to your working page as metafiles. The procedure is outlined in my book on pages 68 and 69. According to my records you should have the book by now. Give me a shout if it hasn't shown up. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 18 Tue Jan 18, 1994 TQUINN [Terry~Sysop] at 18:04 EST The first 200 messages in this topic have been archived and are available in Library 13 as file # 31671 (ATWORKS_10.ARC). This archive covers the period between December 20, 1993 and January 18, 1994. Terry Quinn ST RT Sysop and BBS Janitor ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 19 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 18:29 EST How do I write to disk my AW printer draft Mode ? I go up to the SGDOS accessary and hit "DRAFT", I save it or whatever, but at every bootup, it still boots in FINAL mode. What am I doing wrong ? I just want AW to be in DRAFT MODE when I print. Thanks in advance. Mike a ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 20 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 19:23 EST I have uploaded into the atari library " FONTTYPE.STW " file # 31657. With this, you can really see what your GDOS fonts looks like. Letters and characters are shown in 14, 18, and 48 points. Also some examples of different line spacings with sample paragraphs. To use, load into AW. Go to the top line, and, using the backspace key, erase the " FONTTYPE.STW " header. Now, type in the name of the font you want to see.( You don't have to do this part; but it makes it easier to know what's what). Now, to change to the new font: Click EDIT from the menu bar, and click SELECT ALL. From the menu bar click STYLE, and then FONT. Choose the new font. No need to choose a font size. That's it ! Now you can create a notebook full of your font samples used in AW. This makes it much easier to see what the fonts look like in hard copy. Enjoy ! Mike Mastaler ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 21 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 19:26 EST Papa. Thanks for the info on how to write in columns. Yes, I received your AW manual. You mean I'm supposed to *READ* it ? Hmmm. novel idea, "reading a manual" :) Thanks <G>. Mike ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 22 Tue Jan 18, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 22:10 EST Mike, Gee, I know the writing is kinda dry and that's why I put in all the pictures but . . . Hope it gives you the pointer you needed. As far as Draft Mode printing goes - I haven't tried doing it so I can't help you there. I wonder if AW automatically switches you to Quality Mode before printing. One of the guys should be able to help you out on that. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 23 Wed Jan 19, 1994 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 02:18 EST Is it possible to print from the FORM section of the DB. That would be sooooo nice. I'm trying to put together a little system that would allow me to take information from the SS (since I don't think you can do with the DB-am I wrong?) and import it into the WP for invoicing purpose. I'm trying to make it work so that all the information is connected and easy to get to so that record keeping and other financial things could be used interactivly. So far it seems like it's more trouble than its worth. I might as well use my PC for this kind of thing. I wish that wern't the case. How do I set the paths for my data files in AW. It seems to default to the drive that holds AW. I have all my data files for various formats in drive G for easy backup and use with files from other formats. J.VENGROUSK1 I ran into that problem also. It seems that when you have your caps lock on (I'm using Bermuda clock) you can't add fields. If you turn CAPS LOCK OFF you should be able to create the fields you need. It freaked me out when I came accross it also. How could this be was all I could think of :-) Steve Blackburn ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 24 Wed Jan 19, 1994 P.LOUIE1 at 02:22 EST Papa, I've checked my dip switches and it seems correct. Thanks for the order update. I'm looking forward to it. Anyone, Has anyone been able to print labels correctly using a dot-matrix printer? (Mine is an Epson FX85) I can't get the spacing between the labels correctly set. I've used the 'print grid' selection along with other data to show where the labels are, and nothing I've tried seems to work. I've tried setting the paper size and margins but that didn't help. I tried setting the number to labels per column and for my labels, it seems like it should be between 10 and 11, but I can't use fractions. (Set at 10, the spacing is too small, but at 11, it's too big.) I'm using standard Avery 4143 labels (4" X 15/16") on my mono MegaST4 w/TOS 1.4 at 16Mhz, Works 1.207 & SGDOS 4.1. Any help is appreciated! Thanks. -Phil ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 25 Wed Jan 19, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 05:57 EST Steve B., You can't print directly from the single-record side of the DB, but you can set up a WP document that will merge in the information from the records you select in the DB and print the invoices (using Print Merge). In fact this is the main reason I bought AW in the first place - its ability to print out lists, labels and merge letters easily from the database, plus the database being very easy to use. See Chapter 6 in the manual (especially 6.13 ff.). If you're using an older TOS, or Hotwire, Works has problems finding files unless you keep everything in the Works folder. There's a patch to Hotwire in the library that fixes this, but if you don't use Hotwire and have TOS < 2.06, then I don't think there's anything you can do about it presently. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 26 Wed Jan 19, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 06:21 EST Papa, The problem with providing a copy of software is that there is now way to verify the recipient is a registered user. I had to decline to help someone with another piece of software recently, because I didn't know for sure he was legitimate. If I could have determined he had a legal copy, there would have been no problem that I can see. (Developer had given me a personal update with some bug fixes and dropped out of sight.) Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 27 Wed Jan 19, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 06:45 EST Papa, The airplane pictures are cute, but for my money, I'd just as soon you'd stick to screen shots, and save the paper and copying costs. You'd probably get the stuff out faster, too. :-) gnox, Does that Hotwire patch change the version number? I can't remember if I patched, and don't know how to check? Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 28 Wed Jan 19, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 08:44 EST Mike, Does it print in draft mode the first time you set it to draft? Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 29 Wed Jan 19, 1994 K.GERDES [TraceTech] at 19:28 EST [WARNING: Off-topic message, but I thought I should speak up. ;) ] This was posted in the LoadAladdin support topic... ST Aladdin Category 2, Topic 6 Message 77 Thu Jan 06, 1994 K.GERDES [TraceTech] at 22:01 EST Two files have been uploaded in the file library: 1) LDALDEMO.LZH - file #330 Demo of LoadAladdin v1.0 r7. 5 minute online connect time limit and LoadAlad's configuration file is not maintained. 2) LDALUPD7.LZH - file #331 Registered user patch update from r6 to r7. Now includes 'Line Guard'. Automatically hangs up modem after X minutes of idle serial I/O. Handy for those times you hit 'Stay'; get stuck online; etc. - Keith [TraceTech] NOTE: These are in the ST Aladdin RT's file library, not the ST RT. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 30 Wed Jan 19, 1994 J.ROGOZINSK2 [Rogo] at 20:50 EST >Has anyone been able to print labels correctly using a dot-matrix >printer? (Mine is an Epson FX85) I can't get the spacing between the >labels correctly set. I've used... > >I've tried setting the paper size and margins but that didn't help. >I tried setting... > I was trying to do this the other day myself and was having no luck. I figured I would have to play around with the setting a little more but haven't had a chance to. The problem I was encountering was after AW printed one label it would feed about 10 more through the printer (StarNX1000) blank. I had the page length set for one label per page (15/16) for Avery Labels 4145 (3 1/2 x 15/16). Like Phil, any help would be appricated. Thanks. === Joe Rogo === Wednesday, January 19, 1994 7:30 pm ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 31 Wed Jan 19, 1994 R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{] at 23:58 EST Papa - having visited this board for over a year I will give you my assurance that nobody, repeat NOBODY gets away with being opinionated, overbearing, or longwinded without being body slammed, reined in, topic copped, checked, and grabbed by the short hairs. (not to mention having spelling and grammer gratuitously corrected). If you haven't be stepped on, mauled, and textually abused by several different GEniuses then you are doing better than ok. ps - IMHO you are an asset. I'm very pleased you continue to post. Also, nice work on the Guide and thanks for providing the free update. (:{ Grouch. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 32 Thu Jan 20, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 03:08 EST Mike, Does it print in draft mode the first time you set it to draft? Al Yes, Al, it prints in draft mode after I tick it. I've put a note at the speedoGDOS area; seems the Gdos manual says to "SAVE" my configuration; the trouble is, there is NO save button to click onto (V4.1) I'll wait and see. Mike ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 33 Thu Jan 20, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 03:20 EST I have uploaded into the atari Library " DECIMAL.STW " file # 31670. This is a simple AW chart for those of you who goes bonkers when you try to figure out your paycheck. what does 40.65 hours mean ? What is that in minutes ? Just pin this on the bulletin board at home or work, and you can find out, fast. P.S. ( .65 of an hour is 39 minutes ). Enjoy ! Mike a ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 34 Thu Jan 20, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:22 EST Grouch, Textual abuse, eh? I tried that once but the neighbors were looking. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 35 Thu Jan 20, 1994 G.ROUSH [Gary Roush] at 03:25 EST Phil, <Has anyone been able to print labels correctly using a dot-matrix printer? <(Mine is an Epson FX85) I can't get the spacing between the labels correctly <set. I've used the 'print grid' selection along with other data to show <where the labels are, and nothing I've tried seems to work. <I've tried setting the paper size and margins but that didn't help. I tried <setting the number to labels per column and for my labels, it seems like it <should be between 10 and 11, but I can't use fractions. (Set at 10, the <spacing is too small, but at 11, it's too big.) I'm using standard Avery <4143 labels (4" X 15/16") on my mono MegaST4 w/TOS 1.4 at 16Mhz, Works 1.207 <& SGDOS 4.1. I suspect it is the driver that you are using that isn't working properly for your printer. For instance, when I was printing my efforts, I noticed it wasn't staying within the page and it was going too far before going to the next page. I realized that perhaps the printer driver wasn't the correct one. I switched to another one and it worked and had the correct amount of spacing. Try this if you haven't done it already...write a letter or load in something so that it is at least one page long. No Headings or Footers, just plain writing with 66 lines length for a page and print it. Check and see where it begins and where it ends for the page after you have printed it. Did it stay within the page or come short or go over the perforation? I think you will find that it either went over the page before going to the next page or finished short of the page. If it printed a perfect 66 pages within the page, try putting that page over the labels you are printing on and see if the lines line up with the labels or not. This should help you determine what to do from that point. Hope this helps. One thing about this is that there simply are not enough drivers for us for all the printers each of us use. This is hopefully something that will be improved in the near future. It must! PRADIP, When and where is the fix for the 1.207 going to come? I bought this version new at the store so there is no going back! People ask me to show the printout and I have to apologize for the BPS that occurs. that I have to wait for an updated program which will fix this, which I am not happy to have to report. Yes, I'll be patient, but something like this should be fixed pronto for the sake of a happy Atari user base and an potential new one. Also, tell us about the printer drivers that we need to have access to since I have a printer but don't have access to the correct one. It took a long time to find one, but it was with another name for another printer and yet seems to work. I use the LQ800 printer and had to use the Star-15 driver. Someone here in the topic helped me out on that one. What about those who aren't using GEnie? Those poor guys. Please give us a hint or note on what you will be doing about this. Thanks. Everyone, By the way, for those interested in knowing, I live in Simi Valley and that is close to where the big LA earthquake was. It is 12 miles west from the epicenter in the San Fernando Valley where the BIG JOLT hit! Yep, it woke me right up, and my wife and I grabbed the kids and made it through safely! It was pitch black everywhere (electricity was gone) and our lamp with batteries which we picked up didn't work. Someone drained out the batteries! (probably the kids doing it), and finally we found the flashlights that worked! The quake stopped shortly after this and we turned on the flashlights and looked around. OOOOOOOO man, what a sight to see everything in our place in an upheaval, shelves fallen down, TV's down, chairs down, books all over the floor, kitchen appliances and dishes, food from the refrigerator all over on the kitchen floor, stereo equipment down, the computer monitor down, and the file cabinet down. Luckily the computer monitor survived the fall and still works! But all my TV's died, waaahhh. None the less with the monitor still running, I can keep on computing! I'd die if I couldn't compute anymore, sniff sniff. What a heck of a quake!!! The family is fortunately fine. Kids are fine and taking this in stride. They think it was fun, but when the aftershocks come in...they get a little scared, ha ha. Anyone want to come by and join the next series of quakes? 8.0? Seriously, it was quite a bad one! It is not something I want to see happen again, but if it's going to come again, then I am prepared for it. Life goes on. <grin> Gary ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 36 Thu Jan 20, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 04:54 EST Ken, I'm pretty sure the Hotwire patch does not change the version number. My patched Hotwire is 115186 bytes, if that's any help. Anyway it can't do any harm to run the patch prg again on it, but if you're not running into any trouble with paths in Works then there's no need! gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 37 Thu Jan 20, 1994 DMJ [dmj] at 19:26 EST Grouch, - (not to mention having spelling and grammer gratuitously - corrected). ^^^^^^^ That's "grammar". <g,d,r> -dmj ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 38 Thu Jan 20, 1994 J.DERNAR at 20:30 EST I have not been able to print out VAG ROUNDED at 100 pts in the outline mode. WHen I try, I get a whole bunch of bombs!! The other fonts seem to work under these conditions. Someone else please try this and let me know if it works on your system. Thanks. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 39 Thu Jan 20, 1994 G.NELSON16 [GFN] at 21:39 EST Everyone, Know what I would like to see? 1. A fully relational AW. If I perform a task in the spreadsheet that is indexed to a database file that DB file would automatically update and vice versa. (rather than clunking in the cut and paste mode) 2. Database capable of turning fields on and off or opening only certain fields ala Superbase. 3. O what the hey just integrate Superbase as the database for AW and I would be happy. (this is the easiest way for me to state my DB desires.) I hate AW Database reports. How do you find the page break lines or markers ? I have yet to see them and since my main DB file has many fields which are not important to my report i need to get rid of them for the report. 4. Snap to grid in DB. 5. Group moves in DB 6. Select fields for export 7. Better calculations in reports not just sums, but averaging, stndr deviations etc. 8. Spreadsheet needs more built in functions. 9. Supression of zeros on screen Oh well more as I get used to this prg. ( I wanted it to be a panacea but all I got was a broad spectrum antibiotic.) GFN ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 40 Thu Jan 20, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 22:59 EST Ken Van, The only way I can see that Atari would be able to do a "backwards" upgrade would be to require return of the original 1.207 disks or the cover from the manual. The disks, at least, would be recyclable. Grouch, Thanks for the encouraging words . . . and the pertinent example! Garsh - I missed that one meself! Gary, Got your EMail. Just happy to hear you and the family are OK. Hope it's the same with the rest of gang over there. Fortunately we don't have anything more than minor rumbles over here from the volcanos on the big island. We just have hurricane and tidal wave parties - at least you get enough warning on those to make a mad rush to the store for extra beer and pretzels. All, I have finally solved the puzzlement of how to get AtariWorks to print "n" copies on the HP4L "Baby" Laserjet instead of sending the page over and over. It involves prefacing a disk file with a job language header then the command to print "n" pages and also a trailer on the disk file to turn the command off (else it become the default). Only takes about 30 bytes of code to do it but the process of printing a page through GSpool to create the disk file then loading into XXED, modifying the file and saving it out to disk takes about 15 minutes per page. The resulting file runs between 500-600k so it's 1 page per floppy. Why bother? It will allow me to send that one page to the printer with the instruction to print, say, 24 copies then after the 1 1/2 to 2 minutes that it takes to load the printer I can get back to doing other things while the pages crank out at about 7 1/2 to the minute. Now all I need is a CLI accessory to handle the file redirection without leaving what I'm working on. Page quality is improved over the Canon copier, there's less waste and my feet feel much better. I will post the procedure to the library as soon as I get the chance to try it out in Pagestream also (ya' lurkin', gnox?) and write it up. I figure I can't be the only person using an HP4L - or am I? 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 41 Thu Jan 20, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 23:39 EST gnox, Thanks. I found the patch in my Hotwire folder, and if I haven't used it, I can. I probably have. It was dated October or something, so I guess I forgot about it. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 42 Fri Jan 21, 1994 THOMPSON2 [STYVWERX] at 02:14 EST Err, Ah, (:{ Grouch, re:, your note to 'Papa', which I agree with wholeheartedly, since when is there an "e" in grammar? <G> ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 43 Fri Jan 21, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 05:25 EST Papa, > (ya' lurkin', gnox?) Yep. > I figure I can't be the only person using an HP4L - or am I? Yep. ;) By the way - I think you mentioned that you sent out some pages for the Grafik Guide quite a while ago (December?) - mine hasn't arrived yet. Seems like the snails are working undertime. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 44 Fri Jan 21, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 06:25 EST Papa, Did 1.207 change any of the other files? It occurred to me that the PRG file alone would be of little use to anyone without the rest of the files, so it might not matter if 1.2 were sent to anyone who wanted it. Only those who had the rest of the package could use it. Right? Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 45 Fri Jan 21, 1994 G.FUQUAY [GGF] at 19:31 EST I would like to have an Epson printer driver for AtariWorks if one is available. My Speedo distribution disk did not have one. I have the SLM605 laser, but there are times I could use my Star SG10, if I had a driver for it. From the thread I have been reading, there seems to be one somewhere, but I have not been able to find it by searching the files. Could someone point me in the right direction? Thanks, Gary ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 46 Fri Jan 21, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 21:43 EST gnox, The pages will be sent next week. I'm doing another batch now. As for the HP4L - the Job Control Language patch should work on all of the HP4 family. Don't know about the older HP's or the HP compatibles. Looks like it will work on Pagestream files too with the same header as for AtariWorks but Pagestream ends the file with a reset. I think that will need to change to a formfeed followed by the exit code from the job. Ken Van, Pradip mentioned some changes in Dialog Boxes and Selector Boxes. I would think that the change would involve replacing at least the resource files along with the prg. Best bet is to replace it totally. Gary F. You should have the Epson FX80 driver on your Speedo disks. The file you are looking for is FX80.SYS. It may have some other name like FX80.PRN or some such. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 47 Fri Jan 21, 1994 R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{] at 22:17 EST dmj - (not to mention having spelling and grammer gratuitously - corrected). ^^^^^^^ I am an English Nelson, not one of those Finnish or Svedish Nelsons and my grammer was looking over my shoulder as I writ that note. See don't like being corrected nun. Now if I was a more Nordic Nelson then maybe I would call her my grammar. . . Got to go now, Mrs. Olsen is calling me for a cup of coffee. (;{ Grouch. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 48 Fri Jan 21, 1994 B.AEIN [B Man] at 22:20 EST For some strange reason, AW will not let me print. It was working fine for the first few times and now it says something to the effect Gdos cannot load driver, maybe need more memory I am using a Mega 4 and 804 laser printer. The print driver has no description just the number 21, And Speedo won't recagnize any other drivers. I am running with only LGS, Data Diet, Maccel3, and squish. Thanks Bman ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 49 Sat Jan 22, 1994 P.LOUIE1 at 01:25 EST Gary, I doubt it's the wrong printer driver because I have a genuine Epson FX85 printer (a faster Epson FX80). I tried other drivers anyway, but none of them worked. What's weird is that the top and bottom margins are off a bit. It's off by about 1/8", and it only happens when I have documents longer than a page. A one page document printout contains correct margin settings. This is getting very strange! With the labels, the program seems to forget that there are spaces between labels. When I print the grid, the borders of the grid match those of the labels, but the Avery labels have spaces between the labels so you can peel them off. Works seems to think that there are no spaces between labels. I can't seem to fix it by adjusting the number of labels in a column or by adjusting the paper size and margins. I'm using Works 1.207, SGDOS 4.1, mono MegaST4 @16Mhz w/TOS 1.4. Anyone have any solutions?! TIA, Phil ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 50 Sat Jan 22, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:04 EST Gary, Your Speedo disk didn't come with a driver named FX80.SYS? It's the standard one, and should have been on all the disks. I'm not sure how this should be handled, but any of us could ship it to you if Atari doesn't mind. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 51 Sat Jan 22, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 06:52 EST Bman, I haven't run into that problem with the Mega 4/SLM 804/Speedo combination, but if I did, I think I'd start by tinkering with the Speedo cache options. The only parameter involving Works itself that I know of is that having other files open (besides the one you're printing) will reduce the available RAM. Probably Papa knows more about this. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 52 Sat Jan 22, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:42 EST Papa, Thanks. I guess that means if I were to give a copy of v. 1.2 PRG and RSC to someone who claims to have 1.207, I might be giving away too much. If I just gave the PRG, the recipient would have to have the RSC, and that could deter piracy. Of course, if you already knew the recipient was a really honest person... Is there a way to set up a document such as a letterhead like this? xxxxxxx x x Name x IMG x Address x x City, state, ZIP (all "centered" over here) xxxxxxx I wonder if doing two columns would do it. How would I go back to one column afterwards? Can I add another ruler? BMan, I have a Mega STE and SLM804, and sometimes can't print. It sometimes seems to be related to what programs I've run before. I use DeskMgr, and have a rather sparse setup for AW for when that happens, but often can use the same setup I have for WordFlair II with SpeedoGDOS. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 53 Sat Jan 22, 1994 G.NELSON16 [GFN] at 11:05 EST >Atari-ST RoundTable >Category 14, Topic 20 >Message 1 Mon Jan 17, 1994 >B.SEMAAN [BOSEM] at 19:32 EST >I also need a relational database in Atari Works. To me a 'flat' database is >like drinking decaf coffee. I don't care about mailing lists or any other >lists for that matter, and to be frank about it I have never been able to find >any use in a non-relational database. The idea that a relational DB has to be >difficult to use is a total falsehood. I see no reason why the simple tasks >available in AW now would have to become intimidating just to add relational >capability for those users who need it. Besides, many users will find they've >outgrown AW's database as soon as they try to manipulate their data, rather >than simply organize it. > > Bob > >---------- > I must heartily agree with Bob once you have used a relational DataBase evrything else is just flat. Papa, AW's database is just slightly better than a prg called DB One that was distributed with the very first 520 St's back in 1985. I would say that this is a regressive step and not a forward one. (Look, action, placement of fields all are very similiar, AW does allow calculation fields where as DB One did not) GFN ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 54 Sat Jan 22, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 12:46 EST Bman, What Gnox says make sense. But the cache may not be a factor; you can run without a cache at all and see what happens. The cache is always optional, and if Speedo's font engine doesn't find a cache, it creates a dynamic one or the fly from HD space. Ken, Do you have Papa's book? He covers that kind of layout pretty well. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 55 Sat Jan 22, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 16:31 EST B man, You mentioned that your ASSIGN.SYS file showed only 21 without showing a printer driver after it. Were you checking that with the DRIVERS.ACC(PRG)? My suggestion is to manually edit your ASSIGN.SYS file with an ASCII text editor incorporating the screen drivers as they are, 21 SLM804.SYS (or whatever its proper name is) and 31 META.SYS then SAVE AS ASSIGN.SYX. Delete the original ASSIGN.SYS then rename the new one as ASSIGN.SYS. This will ensure that you have the correct data in the file and that it is written to different sectors on the disk than the original. ASSIGN.SYS is read and the drivers loaded when you boot up. The caches are also reserved at this point. My understanding of the SLM is that it needs at least 850k of free memory in order to work. Check your system to make sure that you have at least that much available after you start AtariWorks and load the document. If not you will probably need to trim your auto folder, acc's and caches. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 56 Sat Jan 22, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 16:31 EST Ken Van, Yep, 1.2 wouldn't be much use to a 1.207 user unless you included the stuff in the 1.2 WORKSYS folder. The letterhead with IMG logo is easy to set up. Set a left tab on the line where you want the upper left corner of the IMG to be and set a center tab where you want the letterhead to center itself. Tab over to the Center and type in the letterhead info with a carriage return on each line - that will carry the ruler bar settings down to the next line. Set font sizes and line spacing to get it the way you want it. Go back to the first line and import the IMG at the left tab position. Play with the width of the IMG clicking on Correct Aspect Ratio after each adjustment until the height of the IMG matches the height of the letterhead. You can use the same idea for a landscape oriented page or return address on an envelope that gets printed sideways but you will have to rotate the IMG 90 degrees before you can use it. AtariWorks rotates GEM's OK but it won't rotate an IMG. You can have as many rulers as you have lines on the page. That's how the Paragraph Format/Style Macros are created. They are nothing more than a set of Margin Indents, Tabs, Justifications and Line Spacings created using the tool bar and ruler bar then given a name. When you set the cursor in a paragraph then click on the "PF" icon then select a macro a ruler containing the macro's settings is pasted into that paragraph. Each time you hit [Return] you paste another copy of that ruler onto the new line. The Paragraph Format/Style function in AtariWorks is as powerful as anything I have ever seen in any program including Calamus and Pagestream and is a lot easier to set up. Keeping the Font macros separate is slightly inconvenient but adds greatly to the flexibility. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 57 Sat Jan 22, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 16:31 EST GFN, The more I use AtariWorks, the more firm I become in my opinion that the database and spreadsheet are support functions for the word processor. I think it would be more accurate to call AtariWorks a DOCUMENT PROCESSOR than an "integrated software application". Both the database and the spreadsheet lack features that users of these types of programs find essential. I don't think this is due to any oversight on Pradip's part. I believe it reflects the market that AtariWorks is targeted to - home and small business users whose primary requirement is a good WYSIWIG word processor with the capability of incorporating database and spreadsheet data into documents. The fact that the database and spreadsheet _can_ be used in non-supporting roles adds to their functional value but their REAL purpose is to provide superb mailmerge plus table generation, charting and graphing - ALL for the word processor. I would like to see relational linking between database files and the spreadsheet _provided_ it is sufficiently intuitive that the majority of users will take advantage of it AND be able to do it on an unexpanded 1040ST. Personally, I am more fascinated by what AtariWorks CAN do than by what it cannot do. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 58 Sat Jan 22, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 16:32 EST Al, The little airplanes distract Ken. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 59 Sat Jan 22, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 16:50 EST Well, I give a 'thumbs up" on your little airplanes, Papa; I like em'. Mike (former ultralight pilot) Mastaler :) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 60 Sat Jan 22, 1994 S.AGARWAL [SANJAY] at 17:11 EST I have to use Roman (I,II,III,IV...) instead of Arabic (1,2,3...) page numbers for the first 15 or so pages of a thesis. Is this possible with Atari works?? If not, does anyone know of another Atari wordprocessor that would allow such flexibility. Also, The first page of each chapter requires different margins to the rest of the text. Is this possible with AW? Thanks, Sanjay. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 61 Sat Jan 22, 1994 COMPO at 18:46 EST Sanjay - That's Write 3 will do automatic page/paragraph numbering with Roman or Arabic numerals. Robert ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 62 Sat Jan 22, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 23:00 EST Papa, > The Paragraph Format/Style function in AtariWorks is as powerful as > anything I have ever seen in any program including Calamus and > Pagestream and is a lot easier to set up. As long as you don't change your mind about any of the format/style parameters after you've applied them to the text! When that happens, AWorks (unlike a real DTP program) requires you to go back and select each piece of text and change it manually. - unless I'm missing something! gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 63 Sun Jan 23, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 00:21 EST Al, Yes, I have the book, but it's at the office. I'm glad to know the information I seek is in it, though. I'll check it Monday. Oh, I guess I don't have to. Thanks, Papa. I had to get the fly swatter out 'cause those little planes kept buzzin' around my haid. Mike, Former ultralight pilot, eh? I thought about getting the model that looks like a sport parachute to use for aerial photos of geologic features. Not sure that's the way I want to die. gnox, Select All will allow you to change point size, at least. I don't know about other parameters. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 64 Sun Jan 23, 1994 G.FUQUAY [GGF] at 00:25 EST 'Papa', No such animal on my distribution disk. I checked that before posting. However, I found one on the MS-Write disk and put it in the folder with the other drivers. But Speedo refuses to recognize it. I then tried the NX1000 driver, and it seems to work with the SG-10 ok. I will use it until I find otherwise. Thanks, Gary ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 65 Sun Jan 23, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:24 EST He's winging it, Papa. Sanjay, Calligrapher does all you are asking. It's a very serious word processor, with oodles of options and a lot of power. Works is great, but Cal is heavy duty. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 66 Sun Jan 23, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 08:13 EST I'm setting up my first collection of More Than A Floppy computersystem. just got a used MEGA 4 ST and am fiddling around with a SyQuest 44 and a MiniScribe 65. currentl;y have D-E-F on the Miniscribe ( 3 partitions are GEM partitions.. opne is an ACK partition and the system doesn't 'see' it... what the heck's an ACK partition?) and F-G-H on the Syquest. Boots off C and A- Works is in D. My Confusion: Atariworkas starts up fine.. but can't seem to find it's Fonts.. I get that warning box about not finding Font drivers and not being able to print. Aworks comes up with just teh System Font. NOW- the desk acc ( and internal ) OUTLINE FONTS manager guys always know RIGHT where those fonts are.. and they;'re all loaded with just the ones i'v specified. this all worksd fine when I boot the Syquest with the other HD offline ( the Old Way Ive been using my old ST) ansd WAS working fine off the HD and Sy systems till late yesterday. I've been trying to find a clue and c an't... HELLLLLLLLLLLPP!! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 67 Sun Jan 23, 1994 R.GRABLE [Richie] at 14:27 EST My wife has been using AWorks for several months now but has just started using the spreadsheet. It's similar to her Mac at work and is quite easy to use. One thing she hasn't been able to figure out though is how to turn off the border when printing. Other than that this package is quite impressive. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 68 Sun Jan 23, 1994 G.NELSON16 [GFN] at 15:02 EST So, many of you who are using Atari Works probably thought I was ragging it. Well I was, but now I'm going to eat some crow because I just spent some time with Microsoft Works and Claris Works. My conclusion is that AW is as good if not better in some regards than these other programs. That is not to say I find it any less deficient, but all integrated prgs are that at this moment. My initial reaction was one of disappointment, now it is one of acceptance for what it is. I still would like to see maybe a pro version of AW that would blow the othe works type prgs away. One that integrated a relational database interactive modules and extensive reporting as well as processing. In terms of improving the existing program I would say being able to set a colour palette for certain aspects of the program (such as being able to define page breaks in blue or red etc. while being able to alter other colour aspects would make viewing the page that much simpler. As to other improvements that would be reasonable, Easier field selection for reports, (this would be so fields maintain the data input sequence). Reports should be able to average, standard deviation and sum. These few things would put AW on top of the heap across platforms. GFN ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 69 Sun Jan 23, 1994 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 16:14 EST One thing that makes the DB and SS portions of AW almost unusable to me is the fact that I can't turn off the Bold in the column and row headers. With Speedo on in ST Medium, the draw/redraw of bolding is agonizingly slow! (I cheat - for some reason turning off the BLiTTER turns off all bolding in AW). I never use bolding if I have the proper bold font. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~Sysop Written: 1:43 PM Mountain Time Sunday, January 23, 1994 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 70 Sun Jan 23, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 16:40 EST GFN, I think that integrated programs typically are somewhat less than stand-alone programs for each function. All, I guess if want to be straight about it, we'll have to have Atari tell us what is legal to do as far as helping folks with 1.207 downgrade to 1.2. I'd really like to help a guy who asked me to, and I have no doubts he has a legal package of AW. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 71 Sun Jan 23, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 17:15 EST Sanjay, . AtariWorks only supports the Arabic numerals in Header/Footer. Calligrapher or That's Write may be a better choice for what you are trying to do. That's Write supports Speedo fonts - Calligrapher uses URW outline fonts which are not as good at large point sizes. . The first page margin difference might be accomodated by leaving the margins alone and setting the Right and Left Indents to get the same effect. . gnox, . AtariWorks will do a global Format/Style change of _all_ paragraphs but it won't let you do a global search/replace one Format/Style with another like Pagestream does. If you only want to change certain paragraphs you do have to do it manually, as you said, but it's only a 3 mouse click process to do it. Click once anywhere in the paragraph, once on the "PF" icon and then again on the desired format. (Yeah, I know that you already know that - but there may be some lurkers who don't). . GGF, . The driver from the MS-Write disk is probably for GDOS or GDOS 1.1 and that's why it doesn't work. I'm surprised that you don't have an FX-80 driver. I just checked my Speedo distribution disks and it was in the DRIVER folder on Disk #1. There is also a DRIVER folder on Disk #2 that contains other printer drivers. . Richie, . You can turn off the spreadsheet grid but you can't turn off the border. The only way to get rid of it is to copy the spreadsheet to the word processor and print from there. If you do a straight copy with row/column headers turned OFF there will be a left margin offset where the row header would have been. I prefer to copy the spreadsheet as a metafile because then I can position it and resize it at will. . GFN, . Sort of like the difference between Microsoft Works and Microsoft Office. If you want the slim, trim 80% solution you get Works but if you need to get 80% of the remaining 20% you gotta pay through the nose for Office. . On the Atari side it's AtariWorks or That's Write/Superbase/LDWPower. . All, . Over in the Speedo Topic someone was asking for help in adding bitmap fonts for use with Speedo. This reminded me of something that I don't think I have mentioned before. When you mix bitmap and Speedo fonts on the same page you may get unexpected results on the printout. I did a letterhead with the company name as a bitmap and lines below it in Speedo. Looked great on screen but when I printed it out each of the words in the address was tilted slightly. The cure was to put a blank line only 1 point high between the bitmap and Speedo font lines. This was in AW 1.2 and Speedo 4.1. I don't know if this would also occur in later versions. . 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 72 Sun Jan 23, 1994 R.GRABLE [Richie] at 18:32 EST Thanks for the quick reply but everytime I try to copy it as a metafile works says it can't load the driver or may be out of memory. Any ideas? ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 73 Sun Jan 23, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 20:45 EST Showman, An ACK partition is one that produces the sound of gasping when you try to access it. I've never heard of an ACK, to be serious. You should reformat that partition so you can get at it. Is your ASSIGN.SYS in the C: root? EXTEND.SYS there also? Did you try booting without odd desk accessories and auto-folder programs? Does the ASSIGN.SYS point to the proper location of the font folder? Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 74 Sun Jan 23, 1994 R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{] at 22:01 EST Papa - you seem to have overcome your fear of paragraph space but now you appear to be on your period. Might I recommend a tilde or a carrot? (:{ Grouch. ps - It is a lot easier to read now. Thanks. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 75 Sun Jan 23, 1994 R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{] at 22:35 EST Al - ACK is the particular sound that Bill the Cat makes when having a hair-ball. OOP is from Opus the penguin and is like a BGEM partition only with the Spectre GCR formatting the hard drive. I have had the oppertunity to use both ACK and OOP formatted syquest platters and I far perfer the OOP. Of course, now that I have a Falcon I can't use any of my Mac emulation stuff. Make me an offer. (:{ Grouch. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 76 Mon Jan 24, 1994 G.ROUSH [Gary Roush] at 02:48 EST If anyone knows what to do about this problem, I would appreciate it. I am trying to do a spell check, but it doesn't seem to be working. The thesaurus box comes up, but nothing comes up for spell checking. The disk light doesn't come on so I know it isn't even checking it. Anyone know why or if there is something I haven't done right when installing it. I used the install program. Would it have to do with not enough memory? I am using 2 mega ST machine. When I run the program, I have 1.2K and run it from Hotwire. Any answers would help. Thanks. Gary R. P.S. I got hold of a 1.2 version and now I get great printouts! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 77 Mon Jan 24, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 04:58 EST Richie, . Try increasing the size of your miscellaneous cache. . Grouch, . That's caret not carrot! But . . . what can you expect from the progeny of a raging Danish raider? If you vuz a Nillson ve might be cuzzins. I'm a Thorson on my mother's side. . The spaces were always there it's just that Genie strips them out after they get sent up. Periods are easier for me to reach. . Gary, . If you only have 1.2k left there probably isn't room for anything. If it's 1.2mByte then there's plenty of room. AtariWorks does have a path problem that shows up with Hotwire. There is a patch in the library called, oddly enough, AWPATCH.LZH that modifies Hotwire. The path problem is in AtariWorks but the Codeheads were kind enough to patch their program for the sake of compatibility. If you already have the patch doublecheck the path setting in Preferences - it should point to the WORKSYS folder within the WORKS folder. . 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 78 Mon Jan 24, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 08:35 EST Grouch, Papa could use a tomato or musk melon, maybe. Al OOP! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 79 Mon Jan 24, 1994 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 14:14 EST Gary, I had the same problem and it was caused by a trashed WORKS.INF file. Delete or rename the inf file and the restart works. Go to the preferences menu selelction and set it up. Don't forget the path under thesaurus/dictionary. You might want to check this before you re-do the inf file. Could be that the path is just wrong. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~Sysop Written: 1:27 AM Mountain Time Monday, January 24, 1994 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 80 Mon Jan 24, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 21:12 EST Al.. I'l check on the Assign SYS and EXTEND SYS.... ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 81 Mon Jan 24, 1994 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 22:56 EST To me, why have printing routines specially designed for the WP, SS & DB when you can use the print routines already in the WP. To me, this saves a lot of memory by having one print routine and layout abilities using the WP part. It would seem that extra code would have to have been added to support the kind of layout, formatting, etc. abilities you get with the WP part. By doing it this way, it seems that it allowed the program size to stay small and be useable on a 1 meg system. Yes, it is a little more work but, I feel you have a lot more control over the way things look by placing the info into the WP. Papa, why not use *SN when saving the message. This will stop GEnie from mangling the message. I modified Aladdin to do this now. I got tired of trying to remember to put 2 spaces on a line. :-) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 82 Mon Jan 24, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 23:38 EST Wayne, The lost spaces in my posts were due to the way the older version of G_ORACLE was written. I just received the latest update from Paul today that is supposed to correct the problem. Having written a few programs in my day, I seriously doubt that the savings in program size would be very great. Perhaps 50 to 60k at most. I use the print routines from the Database and Spreadsheet for quick reports and rough drafts. Finished product goes through the WP. I have a feeling that this was semi-intentional when the program was written. Why put in a lot of code for pretty printing when you can copy the data to the Word Processor to accomplish the same result? On the other hand why force people to go to the WP when all they need is a fast report for internal use? 'Papa' who hopes his spaces are back (melons and tomatos in reserve) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 83 Mon Jan 24, 1994 S.KAINE at 23:43 EST 'Papa'... I've got two questions. #1) When I print out (NX1000) your Fun Font tutorial, the first page text is normal Dutch font. When the second page prints, the text is all in italics, but the screen shows the normal font. How come? #2)When I print out your 1994 calendar, the text is quished together. I've changed the font to a thinner one. I've made the margins smaller, to make the calendar larger, but to no avail. Any ideas beyond just making my own from scratch? ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 84 Tue Jan 25, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 03:31 EST S.Kaine, You didn't mention what kind of monitor you are using. I have received reports of some people having the kind of problem you are experiencing with the calendar. One of the guys said that it did not print properly when he was running in medium resolution color but _did_ print correctly when he fooled his system into thinking he had a monochrome monitor by running SEBRA.PRG (I believe it's in the library). The other possibility is a peculiarity in the printer driver's response when it runs into one of my perfectly ordinary efforts - or should that be the other way 'round? All of my work is done in monochrome and proofed on an HP DJ500 before uploading. Apparently there are problems with a few of my things when run in medium res or with other printer drivers. Yours was the first report I have had about problems with the Fun Fonts. I have redone the MyDraw files for those fonts to make them larger and easier to see. I will try to upload them as soon as I can. I plan on releasing a commercial version of Fun Fonts later this year when I get a sufficient quantity converted to make it worthwhile. The early versions were converted in Arabesque which creates the GEMs as polylines. I acquired Avant Vector last month which makes the conversion to true beziers. Quality is much improved but it takes time to do the conversions. I hope this is of some assistance. If not possibly one of the guys may have some tips of which I am not aware. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 85 Tue Jan 25, 1994 B.AEIN [B Man] at 23:08 EST Speedo seems to be chocking when I try to use a 72 pt font! Whenever I try to print that file or a new one with a 72pt font, It shows up as a number in the print driver and will not print anything after that! This is on a Mega 4 and SLM 804 laser printer, any ideas? Bman ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 86 Tue Jan 25, 1994 S.KAINE at 23:51 EST Papa... My monitor is a SM124, so I guess the problem is in the driver. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 87 Wed Jan 26, 1994 G.ROUSH [Gary Roush] at 00:54 EST I asked about why the spell checker wasn't working. Someone told me to rename or erase the works.inf file. I renamed it and ran AtariWorks and the spell checker now works. So thanks for the tip! I know Papa mentioned how to do this, but where if any can I find out how to get two columns printing on the WP? Thanks. Gary ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 88 Wed Jan 26, 1994 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 04:03 EST Bman, I have used and printed a 144pt font from AW. AW 1.2, Speedo 4.0, TOS 2.05, MegaSTe4. Canon BJ-300. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~Sysop Written: 1:42 AM Mountain Time Wednesday, January 26, 1994 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 89 Wed Jan 26, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:37 EST I've seen mention of a Dingbats or Wingbats typeface here. Is that supposed to be on the Speedo GDOS font disk? Where can I get it? Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 90 Wed Jan 26, 1994 THOMPSON2 [STYVWERX] at 09:55 EST Papa, someone mentioned your Calendar,(fine work, that) and I may be rehashing something already commented on, but did you know that the month of December had two 17ths? I had fun fixing it in Mydraw. Was this part of the Mydraw tutorial you are working on? I think, now that I've used your Calendar to schedule every day off that I'll get this year, that it is going to have a lot of other uses. Wonder if I can space the months out on a single sheet, and still have room to write REEL small in the squares? Thanx for the format. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 91 Wed Jan 26, 1994 K.OLSON10 [KenO.] at 19:19 EST Hi! How do I get the page numbers to print at the bottom of each page. I can get them to print but only the top half of the line prints so I get an unreadable page number. I am using a BJ 200 printer KenO. :) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 92 Wed Jan 26, 1994 COMPO at 20:34 EST Ken Van - More Wingbats is included with both Atari's SpeedoGDOS and COMPO's Speedo Starter Kit. It is installed when you run the Install program. There are other dingbats fonts available, including the original Zapf Dingbats. Robert ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 93 Wed Jan 26, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 21:56 EST Robert, Hi! I remember you from Wordflair. Thanks. I guess it must be among the typefaces I didn't install. I'll have to fix that. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 94 Thu Jan 27, 1994 K.BROOKS1 [Horizon] at 01:10 EST Anyone out there using MyDraw to create GEM files for use in AW............. has anyone been able to get MyDraw to print to an SLM? I think the program sees Device 21 in the ASSIGN.SYS but only checks the parallel port to see if a printer is attached. All I get is gibberish about the printer not being installed. Keith ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 95 Thu Jan 27, 1994 S.BLACKBURN [STEVE] at 01:19 EST Papa, Al, What utilities or programs do you use to check your memory while you'r running a program, especially in the age of Geneva? How can we be sure where the memory is going and if we are using it to our advantage? I think what we need is a topic on memory management in the ST section here. I get weird things happening when I use Calamus SL. Sometimes I'll only be able to open one file before I start getting out of memory remimders. Does anyone know why that memory expansion board (I think its called the Marpit Xtra Ram 8) hasn't taken the ST world by storm? I would think that now we have AW and Geneva, people would be clamoring (at least talking about it) in these topic pages. I havn't heard much discussion about it. I don't know if it even works properly. I guess that is an indication that the thing isn't the answer... Steve One more thing...can someone tell me how I can get AW to stop redrawing twice? I have Button fix installed. It makes me nuts! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 96 Thu Jan 27, 1994 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 01:37 EST KenO., Try moving where it prints the line numbers up some. When AW (and others) prints out, it is basically printing a graphic image and that image is getting cut off because it goes beyond either your settings or the physical limit of the printer for a page. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 97 Thu Jan 27, 1994 GENIELAMP.ST [John G] at 01:46 EST KenO Set the number located in the footer configuration menu (listed as __" from bottom, or something) to .65 instead of .50. I have the same problem (well not a problem really, it's just the BJ200 can't print in the region you're asking it to) John ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 98 Thu Jan 27, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 03:09 EST I got for the second time BPS with Ver. 1.207. I brought up that maybe this was resolution dependant, but it has happened in med. and now, high res. (1040 STfm, TOS 1.4 ). The good news is, that after doing a warm boot, my Panasonic 24 pin Kx p1123 using the NEC-P series driver, it printed fine. Thank goodness this problem is NOT transferred to a 'saved' doc,; The file are not corrupted. Mike a Also, I received the 50 fonts from Toad, the Wordperfect D)S 6.0 font pack from bitstream. Now, i just read upstream that Compo also has a GDOS starter kit of fonts. Could someone tell me; 1. How many ? 2. Are they different fonts than the bitstream/DOS 6 pack ? 3. How much ? 4. WHERE do we get them ? It's the first I've heard of them. Thanks in advance. Mike ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 99 Thu Jan 27, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:26 EST Gary, Buy Papa's book. :) Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 100 Thu Jan 27, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 05:01 EST Keith, Long time since we've seen you in the RT. MyDraw seems to be a bit finicky when it comes to printing. Even with my 4mByte 1040STe and DJ500 it sometimes comes up with an error message. Usually I can fix it by increasing my Miscellaneous cache. Actually, I prefer to just import the GEM into AW and print from there - works every time. Do you have the same problem when printing from Kandinsky? Mike, The Compo font pack is a starter font pack similar to Atari's Speedo starter pack. If I remember correctly there is only one font that is different. Compo does have other packs available and you can even get individual fonts from them. Robert could give you more info on that. The prices will be higher than the Wordsmurfette pack but that's because there are fewer sales to spread the costs over. Al, Ahhhh, It's good to see you vowels are moving again. :-) STYVWERX, Thanks for pointing out the error in the December calendar. No, this wasn't a tutorial - it was more of a challenge to see if I could do something for AtariWorks that people are always doing in Calamus and that other DTP program, Pagebrook or some such. I will probably do some more tutorial type stuff featuring MyDraw but have no plans to do a MyDraw book - that would kinda' violate the unwritten rules of shareware. MyDraw's author is fluent in English but hasn't written the docs or resources in English because the program is in a constant state of evolution. If enough people from the US and Canada register he might be convinced to do it in English. There's no reason why you can't ungroup one of the months, delete the font and use it as a template for printing the month grid in any size you want. I can't remember if I was able to resize the GEM including font - I would have to get back into it again. I am still surprised to see that this is one of my most popular templates. Steve, I don't use Geneva as much as I would like. When I'm working on the Database book I boot without Geneva so my screenshots look like what everyone will be able to see. I am toying with the idea of featuring a Geneva screenshot on the front cover this time. As far as checking memory goes you can always ALT-TAB to NeoDesk, click on the info and see how much memory is left. As far as Calamus goes - I prefer NOT to use Geneva when running Calamus (particularly SL) since it does tend to be pretty memory intensive. I have Calamus configured in XBoot with minimal AUTO folder stuff, no ACC's and the standard desktop for sessions where I will be working with large files - it speeds things up a bit since there is less use of the virtual memory. Actually, this should all be over in the Geneva topic. I do lurk there also. I seem to recall that the Marpit board is being sold by someone in the US. Personally I think it's a great idea if it works as advertised. The only thing I see as being a hangup is cost - with the Atari market being what it is there may not be that many peoply willing to pump that much more into their computer. It's safer putting it into peripherals that can be transfered to other platforms if they make the move. I would love to get my hands on a memory expansion and one of the new T36 boards but can't afford it at present. One of the nice things about having a Marpit memory expansion would be the possibility of putting all the Speedo fonts on a RAM disk. That would definitely speed up AtariWorks (I figured out how to get back on topic :-). Interestingly enough when you run AtariWorks under Geneva you can also run other Speedo applications such as MyDraw without the font loading slowdown. I don't know if the redraw problem is in AtariWorks or Geneva. I have seen it happen with other programs also. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 101 Thu Jan 27, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 05:07 EST Steve, > What utilities or programs do you use to check your memory while > you'r running a program I think Al is using the Bermuda Clock, which gives a constant display of available RAM. I know I am! It's in the library as BSPCLK.LZH. > ...can someone tell me how I can get AW to stop redrawing twice? Sure - don't use the scroll bars. :) gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 102 Thu Jan 27, 1994 PRADIP [Pradip@Works] at 13:52 EST Everybody I think I have fixed the BPS. Right now we are testing the new rev and once we are sure, I will let you know. Thanks a lot for you support. Pradip ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 103 Thu Jan 27, 1994 ARCHIVIST [Charlie] at 14:41 EST Pradip, that's great news! I hope whatever you have done works. Charlie/sysop ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 104 Thu Jan 27, 1994 S.KAINE at 21:58 EST Papa... It seems my NX1000 squishes all the fonts in a GEM Metafile. So what I did was load one of your months into AW and using the drawing feature, I made a template without letters or numbers. I saved the template as a GEM metafile (using the undocumented feature) and create each month of the calendar. I can use different fonts for numbers and days of the week, etc. and I use saved formats for entering it. It took a little time, but it works. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 105 Thu Jan 27, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 22:12 EST gnox, What do you expect him to do? Work in full page preview mode? Need BIGSCREEN for that! May you spend your days scrolling Pagesteam in X1500 magnification! ;-) Pradip, Hooray, hooray! Thank you, thank you! 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 106 Thu Jan 27, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 22:22 EST S.Kaine, There are probably some folks out there that could use the changes you have made. Lots of 9 and 24 pin printers in use. How about uploading your revisions and maybe a description of the procedure you used to do it? I certainly wouldn't mind and I'm sure it would be appreciated by others. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 107 Thu Jan 27, 1994 B.AEIN [B Man] at 23:34 EST Just got the book! Very nice. I wish all ST/F030 software had such nice instructions. Does anyone know how to print to Post Card type paper on a SLM 804? Does anyone sell prefabed sheets or will I need to cut the paper by hand? I assume I can have speedo set up so that there is only 1 font, and then dynamicaly add fonts as I need them? I have the W perfect 50 font disks, what other font disks are a good buy? Thanks Bman ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 108 Thu Jan 27, 1994 K.BROOKS1 [Horizon] at 23:55 EST Yeah Papa...... been a while since I have been into the topics and posted anything. Been busy trying to source a keyboard adapter/interface to fit the Jaguar since Atari doesn't seem to be making computers anymore. ;-) Still putting out good work, nay great work from AW with the 605. Beats the output from Word for Windows everyday. I hear Papyrus is going to be released any day now. Powerhouse WP is only a little bit away. Now if we could just get a decent Speedo spreadsheet but KSpread v5.0 is not released yet. Oh well. I think the Mac PowerPC is in my future soon. Not a chance Atari will be selling TT's anymore and the Falcon just doesn't cut it for anyone doing business and DTP. I'll keep the faith a little longer I suspect. Maybe. Keith ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 109 Fri Jan 28, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:25 EST Mike Allen, I've printed and displayed all of the 60 or so fonts I have at all sizes, incremented in 1-point units, from 4 points to 144, without a problem. (Yep, took a lot of time to do that, but those fonts sure look good.) Steve, The Bermuda /\ Clock reads out memory constantly. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 110 Fri Jan 28, 1994 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 04:19 EST Al, Yep, I've printed out various point sizes of my fonts without any problems either. I haven't been as exhaustive as you, though. I used the 144pt text in landscape to print GEnie signs for last years Atari Fiesta in San Antonio. The BubbleJet output looked very nice. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~Sysop Written: 2:02 AM Mountain Time Friday, January 28, 1994 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 111 Fri Jan 28, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 04:55 EST Bman, You can set up your EXTEND.SYS file with only one font if you wish and dynamically add/delete fonts without having to reboot. AtariWorks and other Speedo font using applications will have to be restarted to see the change. The EXTEND.SYS file is read each time you start an application. If you want a minimal setup I would suggest Swiss 721, Dutch 801 and More Wingbats. You can use the attributes for bold and italic when composing then switch to the real thing before printing. I don't think you will notice much speed difference when starting AtariWorks and there will be NO savings in RAM between one font and a dozen. Keith, Well, as they say, "It ain't the platform you run on - it's what you do with it". With Lexicor selling a TT superclone there may be some hope on the high end. The Falcon I've played around with at Neutronics is impressive - particularly when running in mono emulation. Color is very nice but unless I have a particular need to use color in something I prefer to work in mono. The key, of course, is going to lie in the dealer support you can get and that goes right back to the support _they_ get from Atari. I remain optimistic, especially so after reading the post from Pradip that BPS may be solved. I may be naive but I believe that AtariWorks is one of the key elements in keeping Atari alive in the computer world. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 112 Fri Jan 28, 1994 THOMPSON2 [STYVWERX] at 10:07 EST 'Papa' I tried sizing the GEM images of your calendar, two to a page, and it works like a charm, at least when printed out on my BJ-200. All of the type reduces in proportion, and with a 6 or 8 point font, and close line spacing, I will have usable sheets to schedule work with, that are eminently Faxable, with Straight Fax, right from Works. Thanks again! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 113 Fri Jan 28, 1994 THOMPSON2 [STYVWERX] at 10:53 EST Keith, I know this is a little bit off-topic, but if you get any info on K- Spread 5, would you pass it along? I would just LOVE it if the output from K would import to AtariWorks (there, back on) so that the Works package would, by implication, pick up the use of a powerful macro language capability to couple with the First Class Hard Copy output that it now has. As a matter of fact, I think I'd pick up the tab for flying Pradip over for a week with 'Papa' if he'd find a way to merge LDW into V.2.0 of Works. I have so many uses for "automated" spreadsheets to do all of the computations on forms like Purchase Orders and Job Cost Estimates, that I can't even count them. 'Papa' You're not naive at all in your assumption about Works. Windows users are blown away at the things Works gives me, and at how easily it "works". It, StraightFax, and DynaCadd,(which is in need of update) used with Geneva, are the heart and soul of why I use Atari, both at home and at work, and love it! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 114 Fri Jan 28, 1994 R.WILSON36 [Bob Wilson] at 19:34 EST PRADIP If you have solved the problem with BPS, I hope that a patch can be uploaded here rather than making everyone return disks to ATARI (especially given the poor support the computer line is now getting). After all it was not the users' mistake. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 115 Fri Jan 28, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 22:49 EST STYVWERX, Seemed to me like I could resize those but I couldn't remember for sure. Glad it worked out for you. Now you need to get a fresnel magnifier and print the year out business card size! Pradip, I second Bob Wilson's suggestion about doing it as a patch that could be downloaded from GEnie, Compuserve and Delphi. I don't think there is a problem with pirate copies of 1.207. If there are any pirate copies of AtariWorks they are almost certainly going to be 1.2. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 116 Fri Jan 28, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 23:34 EST Bman, You can have one font in Speedo. Just set it up that way. You can also run without Speedo, although you need GDOS of some kind (G+Plus, NVDI) to print. Keith, Atari has delivered a new shipment of TTs to Europe. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 117 Sat Jan 29, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 00:37 EST Styv, That's a good point. Ataris have "soul," whatever that is, and it's a quality that keeps us entranced. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 118 Sat Jan 29, 1994 G.ROUSH [Gary Roush] at 00:54 EST I agree that AtariWorks is the program that will bring life to the Atari models. If we can see a big improvement in the 2.0 upgrade and see most of our wishes in it, I am sure many people would have eyes on the Atari computer line because most people buy computers mainly to do those three things that AtariWorks comes with. At that price and power, it's a good go for it... Looking forward to the patch to come if that's to be... Good job Pradip, keep it up and keep in touch with us... Roush ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 119 Sat Jan 29, 1994 D.WALTER7 [Doug Walter] at 01:10 EST Keith, To further expand on what Al said, Sheldon Winick just posted in the TT category that Atari called him and said that TT's are shipping _in the U.S._, starting Monday. I find that to be _good news_ for a change! Doug7 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 120 Sat Jan 29, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 05:14 EST Gary, et al, Don't expect _too_ much from version 2. I think we will see some functional improvements and perhaps some additional capabilities. I don't think we will see a relational database or dynamic linking to the spreadsheet. What we _will_ see (if enough people keep clamoring for it) are more Speedo applications. EZ Text Pro Vector is already in distribution in England (but limited to only 10 fonts) and TimeWorks is reputed to be revising Publisher. Other mainstream applications will have to join the trend or drop out altogether. One of the things that developers might consider doing is adding support for their products to _import_ AtariWorks files and templates. Atarians are different than the average Windows or Mac home user in that they are less likely to view their computers as "appliances". Al is correct in saying that our Atari's have "soul" - or is that a quality that Atarians have? AtariWorks is aimed squarely at the needs of the "appliance operator" who will find it fulfills 200% of his wordprocessing, database and spreadsheet needs 100% of the time. Power users are always going to find that a "Works" type program only meets 30-50% of their needs 100% of the time. I find a lot of enjoyment in discovering just how much I can do in AtariWorks and programs like MyDraw and Kandinsky that enhance what I can do with AtariWorks. As Speedo using applications become available I plan to get them provided they meet needs that cannot be satisfied in AW. I foresee a day in the not too distant future when Calamus, Outline Art, Pagestream, Arabesque, Opus and Phasar will no longer be able to justify the space they occupy on my hard drive. It won't be AtariWorks that supplants them. It will be Speedo aware applications for handling specialized operations for which AtariWorks is _not_ the "right stuff". 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 121 Sat Jan 29, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 05:53 EST Papa & Bman, > I don't think you will notice much speed difference when starting > AtariWorks and there will be NO savings in RAM between one font and a > dozen. I can confirm this; for a few months I kept a limited set of fonts loaded in Speedo, thinking that Works would take longer to start up if I added more fonts, but now I have all my Speedo fonts loaded by default and can't detect any difference in the time it takes Works to run. (It's still slow. ;) - I should mention that I only have about 25 fonts, though. - By the way, I've been wondering - that WP6 for DOS package of Speedo fonts from Bitstream, does it include the 50 fonts in other formats _besides_ Speedo? (Like Type 1 maybe?) Speaking of WordPerfect, I've been hearing on another network that WP6 for Windows requires a minimum of a 486, 8 megs RAM, and 30 megs hard drive space for a full installation - and even on that setup it's so slow that many are going back to 5.1. Compare this with Atari Works! This is the kind of thing that DOS box consumers don't seem to take into account when comparing hardware prices/performance. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 122 Sat Jan 29, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 08:07 EST It's great to hear Pradip is on the trail of the BPS. I'm glad I have 1.2, but I support Bob's patch suggestion for all the sufferers out there. gnox, The DOS Speedo font pack is strictly Speedo. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 123 Sat Jan 29, 1994 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 09:46 EST I noticed a big difference in run time for AW when I added the 50 fonts. If it's for Windoze, it gonna take a lot of space and be much slower. :-) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 124 Sat Jan 29, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 11:41 EST Ken Van, I installed W6 for Windows the other day on a 4-meg Windows PC. It doesn't need 8 megs of RAM, that's for sure. Where do people get such information? Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 125 Sat Jan 29, 1994 G.NELSON16 [GFN] at 13:46 EST Papa, I would say: Thats Write, Superbase, and KSpread 4 which uses Gdos/speedoGdos and has numerous functions over and above LDW of course LDW is still faster) would be the power system all running under Geneva or MultiTos. I have recently been running under MultiTOS and find it to be usable on my MSTe. AW is handled well and if I need the more [powerful functions of KSpread 4 to manipulate data I can run it along with AW. The largest problem is that to copy data from AW to KS4 since most dedicated SS's do not have cut and paste functions per se the data has to be imported via ascii. But the fact that you can view data from KS4 while working in AW is almost as good. I am becoming more fond of AW daily though still wish for certain things. Is there a overwrite mode in the WP ? It would be nice if some aspects of the WP would function like either WF II or PGS where areas can be defined on screen as text or image areas. With their own separate formats. AW is a little labor intensive to get these types of regions. GFN ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 126 Sat Jan 29, 1994 G.ROUSH [Gary Roush] at 14:38 EST Papa or anyone, Two things that I need assistance on: > How do I key in the ASCII characters higher than 127? I downloaded Papa's document that shows all the characters and bullets that come with the Stock Speedo fonts pack with AtariWorks and couldn't find a way to get those characters. Any help would be appreciated! Wow nice document! > How do I make a metafile of something like a business card? I used the information Pap created and followed the instructions. I used ALT-COPY on the edit menu and saved only the outline of the card, but not the information that is on the card, which I created. I am puzzled on getting both the outline and the card information inside to be copied together, so that I can paste it on another file. Bye the way, Papa, how do I get that book that so many people are raving about on becoming an expert on AtariWorks? How much is it? Thanks and be hearing from ya soon. Roushy ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 127 Sat Jan 29, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 17:46 EST Wayne, I agree, there is a big difference in the time it takes to start AtariWorks _and_ the time it takes to output a document to the printer if you have all the original fonts plus the WP pack loaded. But the difference between only 1 or 2 fonts and 10 to 12 fonts is not as noticeable. That allows you to have immediate access to all the Swiss and Dutch, Wingbats, Symbols and a display face or two without slowing down the startup or print function too badly. I believe the question originally was prompted by a concern over how much memory would be used and that, of course, is a function of cache settings and has no bearing on the number of fonts loaded. GFN, I don't believe there is an overwrite mode in AW. I have never encountered it. I used to use overwrite mode with word processors that could only do monospaced printer fonts. It was handy for editing tables and the like. I have found little need for it in WYSIWIG word processors. The only thing screen areas like WF II or DTP packages would do is allow you to lock a graphic into a particular place on the page then autoflow text around it. The same function can be done with paragraph macros except for the locking and autoflow. So long as you don't add or delete carriage returns _and_ don't change point size or line spacing the graphic will stay where you put it. The paragraph format/style macros let you flow text around left or ride side placement very easily. Flow around centered graphics or irregular text flow _can_ be done but is a laborious procedure. Yo, Roushy! I forget what TOS version you have. If you have TOS 2.06 and above just press [Alt] while entering the three digit ASCII code on the numeric keypad. If you have TOS 2.05 you will need to use EXTAKEY.ACC and select the character from the accessory. If you have TOS 1.0 thru 1.62 you can use the auto folder program ACCENT.PRG to do it with [Alt] numeric keypad combos. I believe Codekeys from the Codeheads also can be used and the Geneva character set utility can also be used. EXTAKEY and ACCENT are both in the library as #8972 and 21311 respectively. When doing something like a business card with mixed text and graphics you need to set up a page with the correct margins for the width of the card. Create the card with the graphics and text, do a trial print to make sure it is the way you want it, then Select All under the Edit menu _before_ you [Alt] Copy it as a metafile. If you Select Picture you will only get the first graphic object placed on the page. I have heard that you can order the book from: Papa's Grafik Press 1228 N. School Street Honolulu, HI 96817 for $16.95 plus $2.00 shipping/handling. That's where I got my copy ;-) 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 128 Sat Jan 29, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 20:03 EST HELP! I'm still baffkled as to why a cannot get the fonts working in AW now that I've installed and have a seemiongly well-running system with a 65meg HD and a SYQ 44. (Mega4 based) I USED to have afun with this system and AW but for many many days now I have not been able to figure out why the system won't find the fonts when I fire up AW. The desk acc font apps do fine and i can see all the fonts in there, bnoth installed and uninstalled, but WORKS doesn;'t sem to recognise this. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 129 Sat Jan 29, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 21:00 EST Showman, I just took a look at the WORKS.INF file to see if it specifies a path to the fonts - it does not. I would surmise that the EXTEND.SYS file is OK since OUTLINE.ACC is working. The problem may be in the pathname in your ASSIGN.SYS file. Check that - if it is correct then try renaming WORKS.PRG to WORKS.PRX and copy a fresh WORKS.PRG from the AW distribution disks. You may have some trashed sectors on your drive. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 130 Sat Jan 29, 1994 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 23:52 EST Papa, Kinda curious why you recommend ACCENT for tos 1.0 through 1.62 and EXTAKEY for tos 2.05? I've been using ACCENT with tos 2.05 for quite a while - works for me. I also have EXTAKEY as a non-resident MDX in MultiDesk Deluxe. Best of both worlds. The ASCII Table in Geneva is much like EXTAKEY except that is has 255 characters - no null character. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~Sysop Written: 9:50 PM Mountain Time Saturday, January 29, 1994 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 131 Sun Jan 30, 1994 J.FANNIN1 [littlejohn] at 00:12 EST 'Papa' How do I find your 94 calendar? Is it a STW file? Sounds like I could use it for all sorts of stuff! I'm also interested in buying your Works manual. Please let me know where & how much. Thanks littlejohn ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 132 Sun Jan 30, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 00:22 EST Wayne, It took forever to boot up for me, too, with the 50 fonts. I'm _very_ selective with them, now. Al, Nobody got that info about W6 from me. GFN, I don't know That's Write, but Calligrapher has a lot of nice features that put it right up there as a document processor. Roushy, You get extended characters with Alt and xxx from the keypad. I think I should upload an AW page with that info. (Did you like it, Papa?) You could also use a CPX called ASCII Tabelle. Oh, yeah. You can listen to Papa about other ACCs, depending on your TOS. ;-) Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 133 Sun Jan 30, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:25 EST GFN, No, Works is always in insert mode. Gary, Papa's book lists a couple of utilities that give pre-TOS-2.06 users access to the high-order ASCII characters. Geneva also does this, and that's just one of its many features. If you do have TOS 2.06 or higher, all you do is hold down the alt key and type the ASCII number into the keypad, BTW. Showman, The fonts worked before, right? Tell us what's different about your setup now. That will help us get to the cause. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 134 Sun Jan 30, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 06:58 EST Al, I could tell you where I got the (mis)information about WP6 for Windows, but there's no point, since I have no doubt that your information is more accurate. (It was not in an Atari message base, though, or any other anti-DOS source!) gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 135 Sun Jan 30, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 08:10 EST Thanks Papa... I'll try Al Fasoldt... thanks.. to be brutally honest, I went from using my trusty old 520ST with 2.5meg and a months old SYQuest 44 to, a week or so ago, a used MEga2 with 4 meg plus a MiniScribe 65 HD and added the Syquest to that setup.. i really like this! ( surprise...) anmd now have a system that I cna keep up wirt real work and a working office setup with.... and stilll have much to learn. ily. The HD came formatted from the previous owner with 3 partitiobns adding ui p to ~45meg.... curioasu since i had been topld it was a 65. (i'm HD illiterate) . I srtartted playing with the ICD tools and found that the drive had one parti tion that was apparentl;y set up for SPECTER GCR and so mysystem didn't recognix we it, I had the system in a wide variety of configs.. abn early one was just th e MEGA and teh Syquest using the booot up 44 cart frmo the 520ST setup... this h ad AW and all my usual work stuff running happi LINE TOO LONG - y. this was also fine on the mega. I went through a lot of fiddling with boot up configs on the HD/44 setup till i got it running.... incompatible auto folder sti`uff and all tghat. it seems to be fine.. but there ARE some anomolies. I've disabled SPEEDO and have WARP9 running.. but it won't seem to activate the mouse accelerator. (disabled SPEEDO when AW wouldn;t loda fonts.. that allowed me to hwve W9 in there.. it;'s the 1992 version). thios sounds messy i suppose.. so maybe a guided to styarting from scratch is the right approach? current AUTO prgs are... DCSHOWIT GPLUS+ FOLDR500 ICDTIME TOPS14FIX2 (THAT SHOULD BE TOS14FIX2) UIS3 WARP9ST ACC ARE CALLUIS CONTROL DIARY20S SI RAM WARP9 CP going now to try Papa's suggexstion 'thanks! ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 136 Sun Jan 30, 1994 DMJ [dmj] at 10:43 EST Al, I believe the reference was to WordPerfect 6, not Word 6. In any case, Word 6 has several enormous bugs in it... one is that occasionally you can't save a file--Word tells you all your disks are full. This one bit us here on Friday at the worst possible time (of course). At least Atari Works doesn't have this kind of problem. (Or so I've heard.) ~dmj ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 137 Sun Jan 30, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 11:50 EST Hi there all. Well, a little looking, a little thinking and wel.. hey, I guess maybe installing GPLUS+ * AND * SPEEDO is Not a Great Idea, eh! p[ulled GPLUS out of the bootup config, and voila! speedo runs happy! Thanks for all the help, sorry if I wasted anyones time to any degree... I'm building a real working system for my frelsnce life for the first time since I got into this in 86... it's neat. but I have tyhisx feeling there's a long way to go ... next... business accounting setups... oh boy. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 138 Sun Jan 30, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 12:01 EST Showman, Don't run G+Plus and Speedo together. ICD has a folder-fix built in. Use it (set it up in the boot config program) instead of the folderfix in the AUTO folder. Anyway, starting from scratch is not only the right approach; it's the only one. :) Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 139 Sun Jan 30, 1994 R.GRABLE [Richie] at 14:42 EST My wife is doing spreadsheet work in AW and becomming somewhat annoyed. She is trying to do legal size landscape printing but AW refuses to set the page up properly (that is, like her mac at work). When she selects the above settings she expects the height to be 8.5 and the width to be 14 but is getting some strange results. This may be partly do to her copying the SS to the WP (to remove the border). Is this something that is being addressed in a future version of AW and/or Speedo? Thanks in advance for your help. BTW, we were never able to get AW to copy as a metafile. Always get the message driver not loader or out of memory. Increased the misc cache but that did not help. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 140 Sun Jan 30, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 16:56 EST Mike, I have had some reports of ACCENT.PRG not working with TOS 2.05 which is why I recommended EXTAKEY. Possibly it may have been a load order problem or conflict with other AUTO programs. littlejohn, The '94 calendar is in the library. File name is AW_94CAL.LZH. You can find the file # by doing a search with "Works" as the key. There's a bunch of stuff up there from several people. The book, "Papa's Grafik Guide to AtariWorks Word Processor", can be ordered from: Papa's Grafik Press 1228 N. School Street Honolulu, HI 96817 Price is $16.95 plus $2.00 shipping/handling. Ken Van, I did get the EMail and the templates. They look good - I like the table presentation for character positions. I may have missed making the reply. There was a spot of bother this weekend when I realized I hadn't done a new year changeover in Phasar for Security Communications. I copied the register into a new folder, decided to get rid of some extraneous files in my main Phasar folder, got distracted momentarily, went back to the computer and DRAGGED ALL OF 1993 CHECKBOOK into the trash _including_ THE NEW FOLDER!!!! Aaarghh, gasp, gulp, grab the checkbook and rush over to Neutronics for a copy of Diamond Edge. Fortunately I was able to recover everything up to September 4 and reconstruct everything after that from printouts I had. My Papa's Grafik Press check register is an AtariWorks database so that wasn't affected. So-o-o, listen to the Old Fool, guys. Replace that trashcan with a folder - you can always take the garbage out later! 'Papa' says so. Showman, What Al said - you would probably be better off backing up those drives then reformat and reconfigure the whole setup. That's the only way to be sure it's right. DCSHOWIT is incompatible with some programs. I would suggest you get TERADESK and Al's "Secrets of Teradesk". Both are in the library. Set it up to autoload your favorite graphics editor when you click on a graphic file. Warp9 versions prior to 3.8 will cause AtariWorks to crash after printing _unless_ you turn off the SCREEN acceleration. You should be able to use your Warp9 with AtariWorks or any other Speedo application with MOUSE acceleration ON without problems. Just remember to turn off the SCREEN acceleration before printing until you can get hold of the upgrade. As far as "wasting anyone's time" - don't worry about it! There are going to be users lurking around the RT who need the same info but may feel uncomfortable asking for it. Everyone benefits from these exercises. Richie, Re: Page Setup 1. Some printers require setting offsets to your margins to center the page. My HP4L requires about .63" as the top margin if I want to get a 1" top margin. The HP DJ500 is darn near perfect as it stands. The Page Setup Dialog refers to the margins correctly for both print modes. 2. Copying a spreadsheet into the word processor without row headers _will_ produce an additional 1/2" offset on the left where the row header would have appeared. This is because AtariWorks copies the tabs that act as delimiters between cells along with the data. You _can_ reformat without a great deal of difficulty. After you have imported the spreadsheet click on Select All under the Edit menu. You will see the tabs appear on your ruler bar. Simply slide each one over to the left 1/2" or - my prefered method - doubleclick on each tab then edit the tab position in the Dialog Box that pops up. Re: Copy as Metafile There is a limit to the size of Metafile that can be handled. It is related to the number of objects contained in the Metafile. If you try copying the _whole_ spreadsheet as a Metafile you may be running into that limit. You can selectively copy blocks of cells as Metafiles. You should be able to do the Metafile copy with any block that does not exceed the number of objects that can be handled _and_ which does not exceed the size of the Miscellaneous Cache. It would be nice to see the option to copy a spreadsheet with row headers turned off and the first tab automatically stripped. Maybe in version 2 - along with row/column freezing. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 141 Sun Jan 30, 1994 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 18:51 EST Showman, Just thought you might want to know, when you edit your messages, it doesn't appear that the backspace is working correctly or something. Take a look at MSG 135 for an example. Richie, Also, make sure you have META.SYS in your FONTS folder. I am not sure if you also need MEMORY.SYS. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 142 Sun Jan 30, 1994 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 22:52 EST gnox, So _you_ were the source of the misinformation. :-) Hear that, Al? Papa, I got your E-Mail for the first post, but not the second. No problem. You had trouble printing the first file, but it worked fine for me. You apparently liked the second one. I think I should post it in the library, but will wait to see if I should include the other one. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 143 Sun Jan 30, 1994 R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{] at 23:05 EST J. VENGROUSK1 >I'm still baffkled< >suggexstion< I suggest you NAM yourself "Popeye" (:{ Grouch. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 144 Mon Jan 31, 1994 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 00:07 EST Papa, The only conflict I have had with ACCENT on my tos 2.05 is with DevPac 2. Not really surprising. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~Sysop Written: 5:48 PM Mountain Time Sunday, January 30, 1994 ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 145 Mon Jan 31, 1994 P.BENSON6 [PKBX] at 01:04 EST I am having problems w/ the print functions of AW.Anyone care to offer some suggestions?I do not own one of the printers that have drivers that came with my AW prg.(what are there-8 of them ?)I have 2 24pins:an Epson and a Panasonic.Neither epson driver works with my printers<the same thing happens on both:one gives me poor-res output like 9pin and the other gives me some kind of garbled non-print(is this driver messed up?)I have been to get one of the Star drivers to work but output is SLOW.Aren't there any other printer drivers out there?WHY isn't there a user-configurable printer driver utility included w/AW?Geez,just about every other program has them I notice there's a "custom" window in the GDOS printer drivers utility but there's no explanation of it's use in the GDOS manual.Also,how do I make the print quality selection in the printer driver window work? Although I've selected "draft" it has no descernable effect. The real question is why was AW shipped with so few printer drivers?I can't believe it's cost.Wordwriter ST came with a whole mess of drivers and it outputs about 4 times as fast ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 146 Mon Jan 31, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 02:30 EST PKBX, SpeedoGDOS ships with a set of somewhat "generic" printer drivers which cover almost all the printers currently being used. This is possible to do since most printers adhere to certain "standards" for graphic output. All output from AtariWorks is graphic - NOT ASCII text characters. This is true of ALL WYSIWIG word processors and desktop publishing packages. Print speed from AtariWorks is as fast or faster than any other comparable program. Programs such as WordWriter and First Word Plus use the printer's built in character set. There are many printer drivers available for these programs because there are no "standards" for internal printer character sets. They are easy to edit because you are dealing with only a few variations on a common code sequence. Since WordWriter and First Word Plus and similar programs use non-scaleable printer fonts their print speed will naturally be faster than AtariWorks. The quality of their output is drastically inferior except at the designed size of their built in fonts. On _some_ printers these are of acceptable quality. On most printers the output from AtariWorks with a similar font will be superior. Given these characteristics you can print a greater number of inferior quality pages with WordWriter (which, by the way, I do like) OR a smaller number of superb quality pages with AtariWorks in the same period of time. AtariWorks also allows you to include graphics on your pages sized and positioned to your liking. WordWriter has no graphics provisions. First Word Plus can include graphics but is not as flexible as AtariWorks in doing so. The appropriate printer drivers for most 24 pin printers will be either the Star or the NEC-P series driver. The Panasonic should take the NEC driver. The printers should _not_ be set up for IBM emulation. They should be in either their native mode or Epson emulation. You will probably want to continue using WordWriter for those times when you need the faster output. As you use AtariWorks more you will find yourself getting addicted to the print quality - speed will be less of a factor than having your pages look their best. In either case you will be able to share files between these two programs via ASCII import/export. You have at your fingertips the best of both worlds. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 147 Mon Jan 31, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 03:08 EST PKBX...... I have a 24 pin Panasonic KX-p1123 printer. I found that the " NEC-P Series " driveer works great; it's 360X360 DPI. Let me know if it works for you. Mike a ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 148 Mon Jan 31, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:24 EST A pox on you, Gnox! ::) Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 149 Mon Jan 31, 1994 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 05:34 EST Papa, > Replace that trashcan with a folder - you can always take the garbage > out later! 'Papa' says so. - or even better, get Data Rescue (from Trace Technologies), and everything you delete will go into a folder automatically, AND the garbage will also get taken out automatically when it gets old (as old as you choose; I keep mine for 15 days). gnox says so. ;) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 150 Mon Jan 31, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 07:55 EST PKBX, WordWriter doesn't print in graphics mode, and that's why it is faster. Others have had good luck using the 24-pin drivers with Works, with Epson and Panasonic printers, and they should have some advice. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 151 Mon Jan 31, 1994 PRADIP [Pradip@Works] at 14:01 EST All The AW is in beta testing for BPS right now. I think it will take a few more days before it is tested with most drivers/printers. As I mentioned before, I can be sure about the fix only after it is tested on different drivers. So please bear with me. Thanks a lot Pradip ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 152 Mon Jan 31, 1994 BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp] at 15:14 EST Thanks Pradip I know you are working hard on it! ~~Brian..Written on Monday 31 January 1994 at 04:11 p.m. ADT ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 153 Mon Jan 31, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 18:59 EST thanks all for the hwlp , enfcouraging words.. and even the critiques! ( i know I;m a typomaniac.. i still haven't launched ALLADIN.... Beginer Advice Accepted.. yes i still do this online live.. i guess that old adrenaline rush has something to do with it..) I'll pull the folder fix out of teh auto. also need to visit the ICD land and gbert the lastest versions. I am ready to step up from my trusty panasonic 1080i to.... something... advice a`has been either the HP Deskjet 500 or an equivalent Cannon Bubblejet... what am i looking at for drivers and such... does that have a bearing on what printer I choose? ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 154 Mon Jan 31, 1994 BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp] at 19:26 EST The Canon BJs work great with AW 1.2 Showman. However, the newest version of AW is being fixed to work with high ended printers. ~~Brian..Written on Monday 31 January 1994 at 08:21 p.m. AD ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 155 Mon Jan 31, 1994 P.BENSON6 [PKBX] at 19:58 EST Thanks to all for the helpful advice:after all I am basically a DMU(dumb music user,unversed in the intricacies of compu-speak.Mike,I did try the NEC driver w/ my 1123 and was very impressed w/ the output.I was not impressed,however,w/ the time it took to print.The problem as I see it is that after every full motion of the print head,the head sits there for a good couple of seconds.Is this normal? Papa:yes,that sounds splendid to switch between programs when I need faster printout.But the problem is that Icannot import files into AW from Wordwriter,can I?Not usable files anyway...if I import ASCI files then the words appear in AW with no spaces between them- most undesirable!Is there a way to overcome this?Does that happen the other way as well?(AW to Wordwriter)My wife uses the computer to write short works of fiction on;many times she needs to see a hard copy of a rough draft:she needs to be able to print in draft mode-why doesn't this function work?Is there a way to disable GDOS and use the printer fonts for quick print-out?Does anyone else think this a feature worth implementing?(Pradip-are you l ng?)Anyway thanks for all the helpful advice.Papa-it looks like I may have to buy your book after all:What an opporitunist you are!(grin)...PKBX ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 156 Mon Jan 31, 1994 J.DERNAR at 20:47 EST BENSON.. simply save your WordWriter files as ASCII text, then import them into works. True, you will see a slow down going to Works. But if you had a laser printer you would gladly accept the marginal slowdown as a trade off for the scalable fonts and beautiful output. The dot matrix printer doesn't do much good anymore. As far as I'm concerned, I have invested in a top notch printer for the quality of the output. I'd still be using the old C64 if it was possible. (for letters that is) ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 157 Mon Jan 31, 1994 D.FREELAND [SAXMAN] at 21:46 EST Time for me to be educated. What is BPS??? ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 158 Mon Jan 31, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 22:21 EST Showman, If you have Steno and Stalker go grab G_ORACLE from the library. It is a nice tight little Stalker script that does the job for me very well and doesn't eat up a lot of hard disk space. It's not as comprehensive as Aladdin but it sure is saving me some bucks! Personally, I like the HP Deskjet 500. Use it with the high capacity cartridges and get the refill kit from Computer Friends. Your cost per page will be dramatically reduced and the cartridges can be refilled many times. Use Skrip or Quink fountain pen ink if you can find it. The oil base ink that Computer friends sells has too much "bleed-thru" to use for double-sided pages. I believe they also have refill kits for the Bubblejets also. Brian, Uh, you mean like 600dpi? Oh, that will be so-o-o pretty! But, gee, that means my 500-600k pages (including graphics) are going to be more like 2-2.5mBytes. Ah, well . . . can't afford one of them babies anyway so I guess I'm safe for the time being. PKBX, There is a printer buffer expansion kit available for the KXP1123. That will cut down on the wait time while the printer sucks up a data from the computer. If I remember correctly the 1123 comes with something like an 8k internal buffer which is about enough for one (count 'em - "1") line of text. It's strange that you are not seeing spaces in the Wordwriter ASCII files. They should be there. Have you tried looking at those files with a file viewer? For hard copies of draft documents your wife will be better off working in Wordwriter. Draft mode in AtariWorks will be somewhat faster but, since it still a graphic printout, not nearly as fast as Wordwriter. If you disable GDOS you can edit in AtariWorks but you _cannot_ print. GDOS is required for printing. 'Papa' ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 159 Mon Jan 31, 1994 BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp] at 22:40 EST Papa, actually I mean any printer above 300 dpi which may have the BPS problem. ~~Brian..Written on Monday 31 January 1994 at 11:37 p.m. ADT ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 160 Mon Jan 31, 1994 G.ROUSH [Gary Roush] at 23:50 EST PKBX, Congrats on buying AtariWorks. I had the same feeling you are having now about your purchase and since finding information from the good guys on this topic, I have been able to get really good printouts that go beyond my expectations. I have the Epson LQ-800, and I am using the Star-15 driver. You probably know by now to use that one. Yes, the printing is slower than you are used to, but you'll get used to it once you accept the fact that all hi-res printing does take that long to print. It is normal to wait a few seconds before the head moves again. I would like to use draft mode and then do the quality mode for a final print, but I have yet to figure out how to get that working. Perhaps, I have to create two drivers, by using the OUTLINE program, the one that allows me to add printer drivers. Just give it a name, one for quality, and one for draft. I haven't tried it, but I think that would do it, depending if the printer accepts the controls for a draft quality. If you get draft quality, it will print faster, but not be as clear. I had the same feeling to why there were so few drivers. But since the Star- 15 driver works I am happy about it. Beware of the BPS problem. If it hits you, you have the 1.207 version. We will be getting a fix on that very soon from Pradip, the programmer, who is working on it with beta testers. I had the 1.207 version and had BPS problems and got a 1.2 version from a friend until this BPS fix on 1.207 is fixed. By the way, I don't know where you are typing your information and sending it to this topic. If you are typing either online, or whatever, you need to make sure you hit a space on a empty line or GEnie will think it is not a blank line and reformat it, which is probably why the whole thing is all one paragraph. Make sure there is at least a space on the blank line you want. Hope that helps to know. Look at some of the previous messages, and you'll find Papa's address to order the book or guide on how to do most everything you wanted to do on AtariWorks. The knowledge Papa has is incredible. He has put in hours and knows probably more than anyone I know. We call him our AtariWorks Guru. Roushy ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 161 Tue Feb 01, 1994 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 01:20 EST BPS, Black Page Syndrome. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 162 Tue Feb 01, 1994 B.SEMAAN [BOSEM] at 02:00 EST The NEC driver won't work with the EPSON LQ, use the STAR NB15 driver. Bob ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 163 Tue Feb 01, 1994 M.MASTALER [Mike] at 04:23 EST PKBX...... Yes, that NEC_P driver seeme to work with the 1123. It's slow, but not too bad. Are you in DRAFT mode ? Go up to the PRINTER DRIVERS accessory, and set it to DRAFT or FINAL mode. I try to keep mine in DRAFT mode, but for some reason, it always boots up in FINAL mode. I've asked here and in the Speedo topic, and no one seems to have answered why, when I hit "OK" , it doesn't stay in DRAFT mode on boot-up. Oh well.... Mike ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 164 Tue Feb 01, 1994 C.BINCKLEY [-- Chuck --] at 06:26 EST gnox, WP6 for Windows DOES require about 30 megs of disk space for the _full_ installation (which includes the spellchecker, thesaurus, Grammatik 5, many graphics files, and the tutorials), but you can do a minimal installation in about 12-15 megs (I think). The minimum processor required is a _386_, and I'm not sure about RAM, but I know it's either 2 or 4 megs minimum, not _8_. Of course, I don't know what the performance would be on such a minimum setup, since we use 486's at work with DX2/66's and 16 megs RAM, and DX/50's with 8 megs. The DX2/66's are _noticeably_ faster than the 50's, so I can imagine performance on 386's being snail-like. I must admit, though, that WP6 for Windows on a DX2/66 is FAST. Of course, they paid about 4 grand apiece for those computers!(8^})... Hey, Grouch, Ask him if he's got any "rooms for RENK!"(8^})... -- Chuck -- ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 165 Tue Feb 01, 1994 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 21:54 EST Mike, In order to keep the Draft mode selected (even after reboot), just select the Drivers ACC and when the dialog box comes up, select 'Configure'. At the top, you will see a button that has either Final or Draft in it. This is where you make the Permanent change to the setting. The selection on the main dialog box is only valid for that session and will revert back to the default when you reboot. I tested this out to make sure. The one on the main dialog box helps keep you from having to go 2 levels deep just to temporarily switch print quality. ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 166 Tue Feb 01, 1994 J.VENGROUSK1 [SHOWMAN] at 22:49 EST another thing that slows down the printer head wait time is having the program print output go through a Printer Buffer, lik ethe SI RAMDISK has. I have taken to havuing the system boot up WITHOUT an armed print buffer so that I don't absent mindedly launch into a print of a doc and watch in dismay as the thing does a line and then another line and then another line etc etc etc ------------ Category 14, Topic 20 Message 167 Tue Feb 01, 1994 M.HEBERT1 ['Papa'] at 23:26 EST PKBX, I don't believe we have mentioned FPPRINT to aid in your print speed. It is an auto folder program that dramatically improves the speed of sending data out the printer port. Download file #20472 and give it a try. 'Papa' ------------